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Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

mccartney
 
Posts: 94

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Fri Aug 03, 2012 5:23 am


helenpb wrote:I'm still a bit mystified by these new "rules" and the purpose and implementation of them. Once again I have a day off that I can devote to processing images. I see today that regardless of how many images I post, my gallery appears only once every four hours on the Recent Uploads page. Yesterday, it seemed more frequent than that, although I only was able to post images occasionally because of work. Is once every four hours really necessary or fair? Was this and its ramifications well thought out? I thought this was a photo sharing site, but I'm not sure how that can be if you are only allowed to "share" 6 times in a 24-hour period (part of which you presumably wouldn't be using to process photos anyway).

I really wasn't aware of whatever this abuse was that seems to have sparked this, but I assume there must have been a huge outcry from the majority of members to have caused such draconian measures. Once again I have to ask, isn't there some compromise or middle way here? Would it be considered abuse or monopolization of the Recent Uploads page if one gallery could appear once an hour, at a very minimum?

Emily, I agree with Helen completely!!!
Barry McCartney Photography - http://www.pbase.com/mccartney

ellisonphotography
 
Posts: 54

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Fri Aug 03, 2012 4:38 pm


mccartney wrote:
helenpb wrote:I'm still a bit mystified by these new "rules" and the purpose and implementation of them. Once again I have a day off that I can devote to processing images. I see today that regardless of how many images I post, my gallery appears only once every four hours on the Recent Uploads page. Yesterday, it seemed more frequent than that, although I only was able to post images occasionally because of work. Is once every four hours really necessary or fair? Was this and its ramifications well thought out? I thought this was a photo sharing site, but I'm not sure how that can be if you are only allowed to "share" 6 times in a 24-hour period (part of which you presumably wouldn't be using to process photos anyway).

I really wasn't aware of whatever this abuse was that seems to have sparked this, but I assume there must have been a huge outcry from the majority of members to have caused such draconian measures. Once again I have to ask, isn't there some compromise or middle way here? Would it be considered abuse or monopolization of the Recent Uploads page if one gallery could appear once an hour, at a very minimum?

Emily, I agree with Helen completely!!!


Same here!!!

ac
 
Posts: 240

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Fri Aug 03, 2012 5:33 pm


Same here this morning. Out all day long.
Tonight I can post again, but... waiting.
Stop playing with us Emily.

bassrock
 
Posts: 164

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sat Aug 04, 2012 6:55 am


mccartney wrote:
helenpb wrote:I'm still a bit mystified by these new "rules" and the purpose and implementation of them. Once again I have a day off that I can devote to processing images. I see today that regardless of how many images I post, my gallery appears only once every four hours on the Recent Uploads page. Yesterday, it seemed more frequent than that, although I only was able to post images occasionally because of work. Is once every four hours really necessary or fair? Was this and its ramifications well thought out? I thought this was a photo sharing site, but I'm not sure how that can be if you are only allowed to "share" 6 times in a 24-hour period (part of which you presumably wouldn't be using to process photos anyway).

I really wasn't aware of whatever this abuse was that seems to have sparked this, but I assume there must have been a huge outcry from the majority of members to have caused such draconian measures. Once again I have to ask, isn't there some compromise or middle way here? Would it be considered abuse or monopolization of the Recent Uploads page if one gallery could appear once an hour, at a very minimum?

Emily, I agree with Helen completely!!!


+1

If just a few people are abusing the system, then why not write to them directly explaining the rules - you must know who they are - instead of penalising every single PBase user by restricting their use of the recent uploads pages.
Your approach to the issue is heavy handed and completely disproportionate to the problem, IMO.
Indeed, I think most people didn't even realise there was a real problem to be resolved.

And as for the changes, please give us the option to use a simple white background on the recent pages.
The new design with multicoloured text, blue/green background and boxes around everything is far too busy and distracts from the thumbnails.
For me, it causes the "Hermann Grid" optical Illusion effect in which the viewer sees grey areas at the intersection between the black lines everywhere - see here http://listverse.com/2007/09/16/20-amaz ... illusions/

pinemikey
 
Posts: 3065
Location: Cypress, Texas

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sat Aug 04, 2012 3:21 pm


It doesn't really matter if you have a 1 in four hour rule as the people who feel the need to see their name on the front page every minute simply will post in multiple galleries...as is happening now. After four hours they simply rinse and repeat. I like the way you have displayed the recent uploads as my galleries appear immediately opposed to the old wait until 10 minutes goes by way we had before...but the one in four, while has good intention, again only burns the honest people. I'm afraid self aggrandizing posters will continue to find ways to shove their 'work' down everyone's throat in a pathetic bid for attention. I know its been said before, especially about the Show and Tell Forum, but maybe some human moderation is in order instead of some impersonal formulaic algorithm?

amoxtli
 
Posts: 3172
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sat Aug 04, 2012 5:30 pm


pinemikey wrote:It doesn't really matter if you have a 1 in four hour rule as the people who feel the need to see their name on the front page every minute simply will post in multiple galleries...as is happening now. After four hours they simply rinse and repeat. I like the way you have displayed the recent uploads as my galleries appear immediately opposed to the old wait until 10 minutes goes by way we had before...but the one in four, while has good intention, again only burns the honest people. I'm afraid self aggrandizing posters will continue to find ways to shove their 'work' down everyone's throat in a pathetic bid for attention. I know its been said before, especially about the Show and Tell Forum, but maybe some human moderation is in order instead of some impersonal formulaic algorithm?


Agree with you. The Recent Updates Page is a farce. At August 4, 2012 17:24 UTC three guys have about half the recents on the first three pages and some guy has eight insect galleries on the first three recent pages right now.
Some "human moderation" would certainly go along way as it's always the same people. Emily if you read this, how about showing one gallery per subscriber on the recents? That should be doable, and has been requested in the past.
Walter Otto Koenig Architectural Photography: http://www.wokoenig.net

General Photography: http://www.wokoenig.com

Pacific Photographic Society: http://www.pacificphoto.net

mardoli
 
Posts: 585

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sat Aug 04, 2012 9:57 pm


amoxtli wrote: Emily if you read this, how about showing one gallery per subscriber on the recents? That should be doable, and has been requested in the past.

I’m sorry, Walter, I’m not sure I have understood the logic of your proposal.
Does it mean that if I have, for example two new photos which are destined to two different galleries only one of these galleries would be visible?
You are right when you say that the people who post constantly it doesn’t matter what only to have their pictures at the top of the recently updated pages are always the same, they are few and easily identifiable, and I don’t see why all the others must be treated like schoolchildren only because of them.
I do think that “Human moderation”, like you and Michael called, it would be a better option.
Best
Marisa
ImageImage
"Arguments are to be avoided; they are always vulgar and often convincing."
~Oscar Wilde~

amoxtli
 
Posts: 3172
Location: San Diego, California

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sat Aug 04, 2012 10:38 pm


mardoli wrote:
amoxtli wrote: Emily if you read this, how about showing one gallery per subscriber on the recents? That should be doable, and has been requested in the past.

I’m sorry, Walter, I’m not sure I have understood the logic of your proposal.
Does it mean that if I have, for example two new photos which are destined to two different galleries only one of these galleries would be visible?
You are right when you say that the people who post constantly it doesn’t matter what only to have their pictures at the top of the recently updated pages are always the same, they are few and easily identifiable, and I don’t see why all the others must be treated like schoolchildren only because of them.
I do think that “Human moderation”, like you and Michael called, it would be a better option.
Best
Marisa



The logic of my proposal is that you can not upload to multiple galleries simultaneously. As I wrote in my message out of 36 recent galleries earlier today 8 were insect galleries from one subscriber, and there were several other multiple galleries of 3 and 4 each posted as well. If you think that should be permitted, then we disagree.

I practice “Human moderation” on the discussion board of the photo group I organize. I remove inappropriate posts. With almost 900 members these creep up from time to time. I don't see anything wrong with having a responsible moderator.
Walter Otto Koenig Architectural Photography: http://www.wokoenig.net

General Photography: http://www.wokoenig.com

Pacific Photographic Society: http://www.pacificphoto.net

waggonerphotos
 
Posts: 176

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 2:52 am


So let me see if I understand this discussion. First you had a FEW certain individuals deleting and then reloading images to attain attention on the recently uploaded pages.
So access that ALL subscribers was limited (filtered) to uploading to a specific gallery every four hours (which by the way isn't the case).
Now to get around this, certain individuals are creating multiple galleries and posting to them frequently so as to attain attention of the recently uploaded pages.
So now if we prevent a user from being able to post and display to multiple galleries you will restrict that user to only being able to post to one gallery every few hours, yet another layer of restriction.
To carry this extension of logic a few steps further, why not restrict users to one upload per gallery, per day.
Ridiculous, of course. About as absurd as the initial restrictions. Why punish the majority of users for the self aggrandizing actions of a few!

By the Way - The four hour filter really doesn't apply around the clock. From watching the Recently Uploaded Page at different times of the day it would appear to be a means by which
to control the flow of bandwidth usage as much as anything. During the busiest hours of the day, it used to take ten minutes or more for an updated gallery to appear - now only 1 or 2 because
the usage has been restricted. It may very well be four hours before a recently updated gallery appears, but in the very early morning hours when few are posting, this limitation does not seem to apply.
Just the other day in the wee hours I posted two images to the same gallery about twenty minutes apart and the gallery appeared both times.
For those calling for personal moderation as verse an impersonal filter which hurts the majority of users, I AGREE. It really is easy to see who the cheaters are!
Bob Waggoner
Photographs comprise the communal memory of our times. (Unknown)

bracciodiferro
 
Posts: 42

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 7:15 am


Hello everyone!
I propose to put things back as they were before.
But we can imagine to apply a rule like this.
If some guy shows his images for 12 or 24 hours a day every 10 minutes, or has multiple images at the same time (but they never sleep?) We consider this user as a spam generator.
Consequently, after the first 24 hours, this account will be limited to present images or galleries every 4 hours for a week..... (for example)
So normal users will not be punished!
Paolo

helenpb
 
Posts: 78

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 8:02 am


waggonerphotos wrote:uploading to a specific gallery every four hours (which by the way isn't the case).


Well, yes and no. In an earlier message I said one day it seemed that the gallery I had been adding to appeared more frequently than once every four hours, but that was early in the morning Budapest time, so that might have been "the wee hours" in the States, referred to later in the message cited. But the next day, for absolute sure my gallery appeared once every for hours despite the fact that I was adding images to it throughout the day. I was taking note of the time.

As I said before, I object to this once-every-four-hours rule for any one gallery; I feel like the majority is being punished for the "sins" of a few (as Marisa said, being "treated like schoolchildren"). But I also think I would object to being restricted to just one gallery appearing at any one time. Personally, I usually concentrate on one gallery at a time, but I know several PBase friends who have several galleries in progress at a time. They aren't abusing the system; they're multi-tasking. Today I intend to finish up one gallery and return to another; I would be pretty unhappy if the second gallery couldn't appear in the Recent Uploads just because the first one had appeared there an hour (or two or three) before.

I agree some human moderation might be useful in this case; it would certainly be preferable to these drastic and IMO unfair measures. Since several users have already cited recent cases of abuse, it wouldn't be that hard for a moderator to identify offenders and warn, or sanction, them. Then the rest of us could do what we paid to be able to do: Share our photos with our friends in the Pbase community.

waggonerphotos
 
Posts: 176

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 9:32 am


Jacksonville, Florida is 6 hours behind Budapest. My two postings were made at around 3 or 4 AM my time, thus 9 or 10 AM your time. I have seen this more than once in the wee hours
where a specific gallery will appear much more frequently than 4 hours when traffic is slowest.
The whole gist of my post was in support of Marisa's post. Of course we are being treated like children and assuredly being denied what we have paid for. Once you start down that path of
punishing the majority to affect the few, you will always have those who find a way around the restriction It's called passive resistance. Then you have to add further restriction to affect the
ones who have found the work-a-round, and so on and so forth. So where does it stop. The most logical thing to do (if in fact this came about because of transgressors) is to return things to
the way they were and deal directly with those who take advantage.
Best wishes - Bob Waggoner BTW you have some beautiful images!
Bob Waggoner
Photographs comprise the communal memory of our times. (Unknown)

helenpb
 
Posts: 78

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 9:58 am


waggonerphotos wrote:Jacksonville, Florida is 6 hours behind Budapest. My two postings were made at around 3 or 4 AM my time, thus 9 or 10 AM your time. I have seen this more than once in the wee hours
where a specific gallery will appear much more frequently than 4 hours when traffic is slowest.
Best wishes - Bob Waggoner BTW you have some beautiful images!


Why thank you, Bob! :D Thank you for having a look!

Yes, it would have been right before work my time, so 9:00 a.m. and then maybe a half hour to hour again after that. I remember thinking Well this is great! They must have changed the rules! But then the following day proved that wasn't the case.

I could go along with returning things to the way they were and having Pbase deal with "transgressors." But now I'm wondering what constitutes a transgressor. Since I was admittedly oblivious to this problem of people monopolizing the Recent Unloads page, I had a look at it (and maybe three more) a few minutes ago. I saw a guy with several galleries of insects, but they all seemed to be insect-specific galleries full of images, so I don't think he just created new galleries, put a few pics in and posted them. The same held true for a bird person who had numerous galleries on the pages, but again they were all by species and didn't seem to have been created for the purpose of promoting himself. (Of course, I don't know for sure, but this was the impression I got from a quick look.) There was one poster (perhaps of the two of them or another person, can't remember) who did have updated images in a specific gallery and then the same images in his most recent images gallery; that to me might be overdoing it.

In any case, I sure hope this is resolved to everybody's satisfaction, and soon! I'm finding this whole situation a real deterrent to even wanting to add to my galleries.

waggonerphotos
 
Posts: 176

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 10:07 am


I couldn't agree more with your last statement! It just takes the fun and incentive from posting and sharing!
Bob Waggoner
Photographs comprise the communal memory of our times. (Unknown)

helenpb
 
Posts: 78

Re: Updates to Public Pages - Recent, Popular, Random, PaD

Post Sun Aug 05, 2012 12:30 pm


OK, I just noticed one person uploaded I don't know how many images to 14 galleries in the space of something like 20 minutes. Again, they're separated by year (so the galleries are totally different), but I would say that's a lot to have on the Recent Upload pages.

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