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akjack wrote:Does he know that it's the photogs eye that counts,,,Many interviews that he has not read over the years with famous photogs....and they all convey similiar sentiments !!!!

Do you know English? I'm sure that makes sense in your head ...

Plus too many creative writing classes !!!

akjack wrote:I was a liberal then too but wisdom comes with the years !!!

Akjack, just curious why you are here being so busy on this forum. You've started a whole bunch of threads with quite broad questions but despite having been a member of PBase since June 2007, you've not posted a single image in your galleries.

Do you have a camera?

Seriously, I can't figure that out.

nevermind

What is liberal? What is conservative? Who is strictly anything? Who is defining this? I think people who need classifications to judge others on, say more about themselves than they say about anyone else. If looking through a viewfinder makes anyone anything.... I would find it somewhat strange....and disturbingly so.

"The camera is an instrument that teaches people how to see without a camera." Dorothea Lange

Looking through a veiwfinder did actually teach me to see the world in a different way, both physically and philosophically; Which actually changed me, made me a better person. Photography has the power to the change goverments, the course of events and last but not least...People; both viewer and photographer

It would be accurate to describe my views as liberal. I''m tipically against those things that are said to be tipically right wing, such a the death penalty. I was against the war in Iraq but pro Afghanistan (not the same thing) I'm by no means a passivist. I do believe that patriotism is sometimes the last refuge of a scoundrel. Thankfully it now seems people can question the actions of their president without being called unpatriotic. Or being told that if you dont support the war, you dont support the troops, which is a ridiculous statement. Sometimes the most patriotic thing to do is to question your goverment

But the waters can be muddied. A Labour Goverment led by Tony Blair backed a US conservative administrations calls for war. This was against the wishes of the majority
of the UK and and the UN, and it is all he'll be remembered for.

Funny really that jack more then likley doesnt give a flying **** about how anybody replies to this thread, but has raised an interesting debate, if unintentionally. You get stopped shooting in NY or London and that's politics and photography clashing head on. I'm sure many right wing photographers will become a little more liberal should that happen to them, if only for the time it takes to squeeze the shutter.

Yeah in being serious: I do think that really looking at the world and seeing what is 'really' out there does change a person...whether it's looking through a viewfinder (lens cap off) or looking though the eyes (eyelids open) Maybe our response from being human on the inside, and seeing what goes on on the outside is what makes some more "liberal", although like Sean says, the waters can get muddy. Think maybe it can make a person more cynical too, looking out there at the world...maybe a lot more cynical of what goes on. But then again people bring along baggage that might slant their views...we've all got some of that. I truly believe true conservatives stand on principle rather than the cynicism of what I see in the Neo-Cons in the US. where the cynicism has turned them into "me firsters", of course I've seen that in so called liberals too. Guess I just don't like name tags, people are so much more complex than that. Hopefully looking through a viewfinder would make us just more human than we would be otherwise.

well said pal,


I'd say Don McCullen is a a man that was changed by photography, It lifted him out of poverty but he's also haunted by the images of war that he has lived through. He's now turned his back on war photography, but to this day you can still see the darkness in his landscapes. He was a political photography but he himself admits that he became a war junkie

BBC Radio interview, it's really insightful
http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/johntusaint ... ript.shtml

We are a cynical lot when it comes to politics in the UK. Labour and the tories are fighting for the centre ground and they have become so alike that it leaves little choice for the voter, lib dems are a protest vote at best. Politics can sometimes be like your relgion, an accident of birth, much to do with the class sytem which again is something you're born in to. What i can't abide is religion in politcs; But that's a real hornets nest for another day

wow, Sean, long time since I last saw your post... you are still around here? good to see you again

tsienni wrote:wow, Sean, long time since I last saw your post... you are still around here? good to see you again

Hey tsienni

Only in spirit right now

I shall return... I think

I hope you finally got the camera you were happy with

Here we would only have the camera in stock in late June, the price almost equals that of a D80 sold in USA. Waiting, waiting, that's all I can do.

sean_mcr wrote:I hope you finally got the camera you were happy with

Well, I believe Akjack was only meant to casually rant when he started this thread so I didn't really have anything meaningful to say. But I guess since I stumbled in here, I'd better turn to his topic now lest I acted like a hijacker.

Recently Goethe-Institute in Stockholm staged an exhibition on the history of Leica (24x36 - a Change in Perspective). You see the evolution of early models up to the present. To hear the company's own narration about Leica, and a subtle comparison with other electronics "robots" in the market, you really end up getting the ultimate message: Leica = true art of photography. OK one doesn't have to agree on this, but assuming for a moment it is true, I wonder, does Akjack's statement (that photography is a liberal endeavor) would suggest Leica's philosophical affiliation would be on the track of liberalism instead of conservatism?? There's so much discussion in the last decade that Leica has gone very conservative, or maybe always have been change-averse? But to go back in history, when Leica first came out, it's however purely revolutionary, a stunning break from the past...

So, as Leica's story alludes, while SO MANY PHOTOGRAPHES might be LIBERAL, but as they mature, they would just become conservatives nevertheless, much like our friend Akjack??

End of my rant, which is BS for sure.

P.S. for someone curious, here's an early Leica on display in the exhibition:

http://www.pbase.com/tsienni/image/94388988

akjack wrote:Come on now, be honest for once, you know it's true !

A very, very wise photography teacher once taught me, "I don't take sides, I take pictures."

Maybe this is why
http://form.pbase.com/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=37137

While you contemplate your next thread, Jack. Consider the following...

He that cometh to seek after knowledge, with a mind to scorn, shall be sure to find matter for his humour, but no matter for his instruction.