Board index PBase News 24-Sep Downtime

News

24-Sep Downtime

shoshanna
 
Posts: 8

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 2:35 am


The situation appears to be getting worse. As of today, according to my profile page I have 70,724 comments, and the most recent one was made in 1995. First, this is for a gallery site I established in 2002 and, second, although I've never counted the comments, I think the grand total is actually considerably closer to 50 than it is to seventy thousand. The many and varied glitches that have been assaulting our galleries since the major meltdown of a month and a half ago seem to affect different galleries in different ways, but I think it's safe to say that most of us are sick to death of it. The problem is, that isn't going to do any of us any good, nor will it in any way hurry the resolution of the problem.

I established my first account here nine or ten years ago, and since then have seen PBase go through a few major disasters-- and they've ALWAYS followed the same pattern as this one:

1) Virtually no communication from Slug or Emily
2) Angry subscribers venting their frustration, and receiving neither response nor satisfaction from management.
3) Long, long, LONG delays, in which first weeks, and then months go by without any resolution of the problem.
4) Angry subscribers finally growing tired of venting, with a fair percentage moving to (or simply adding) alternative services, such as Flickr or SmugMug, and the rest simply shrugging their shoulders and deciding not to waste any more energy complaining to a management that isn't listening.
5) When the majority of subscribers have concluded-- privately or publicly-- that the situation will never be put right, it finally is.

This is how it's always been and, I imagine, how it will always be at PBase.

As a result, I long ago decided that while this is a great place in which to share pictures with friends, family, and members of lists or forums to which one subscribes, it is wholly and completely inadequate as a primary site from which to market one's work, and I'd never recommend it to anyone for that purpose. Given the yearly subscription rate, PBase is a fair price for what it is, and expecting it to perform as anything more than that seems pretty unreasonable. I'd never use it as my primary business site, nor expect it to function at that level, and am surprised that others seem to expect a great deal of service for very little money.

Use PBase for fun, for sharing, for inviting critique-- but for your work, establish a dedicated site designed for that purpose. If you don't, and continue to expect PBase to be something it's not, you're going to spend a lot of time feeling very, very frustrated.

the_glebe
 
Posts: 91

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 5:43 am


I see nothing has changed, just a considerable amount of time has moved on, its all very depressing. Meanwhile this forum has descended pretty much into a series of dogfights while Slug apparently works around the clock. Feels like a sinking ship. Where's the captain and what's he really doing?

And I thought the Irish government were bad .........

mrmrl
 
Posts: 3

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 12:28 pm


shoshanna wrote:...

Use PBase for fun, for sharing, for inviting critique-- but for your work, establish a dedicated site designed for that purpose. If you don't, and continue to expect PBase to be something it's not, you're going to spend a lot of time feeling very, very frustrated.



Ding! 22 pages and someone finally gets it. Thank you! To me, PBase is best suited for personal sharing and critique, that's all. You "professionals" need to get your own dedicated server if you are a serious business. Shell out some real cash to secure your own precious pixels, not rely on a ~$30/year 3rd party. That way when the s hits the fan, YOU get to stay up all night for weeks trying to recover it. Some people rely on 'teh-internets' way too much...

Only been a PBase member for three years, my measly 2500 photos are all right where I put them. I don't need a counter to remind me at 3AM that anonymous viewers out there are randomly or unintentionally clicking on my uploads, I know they are. PBase management, keep up the tremendous work! Just because teary eyed whiners can be the most vocal doesn't necessarily mean they are the majority...

the_glebe
 
Posts: 91

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 7:04 pm


A photo website without stats is like a digital camera without a histogram

akmc_in_au
 
Posts: 954

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:07 pm


mrmrl wrote:
shoshanna wrote:
Use PBase for fun, for sharing, for inviting critique-- but for your work, establish a dedicated site designed for that purpose. If you don't, and continue to expect PBase to be something it's not, you're going to spend a lot of time feeling very, very frustrated.


Ding! 22 pages and someone finally gets it. Thank you! To me, PBase is best suited for personal sharing and critique, that's all. You "professionals" need to get your own dedicated server if you are a serious business. Shell out some real cash to secure your own precious pixels, not rely on a ~$30/year 3rd party. That way when the s hits the fan, YOU get to stay up all night for weeks trying to recover it. Some people rely on 'teh-internets' way too much...

Only been a PBase member for three years, my measly 2500 photos are all right where I put them. I don't need a counter to remind me at 3AM that anonymous viewers out there are randomly or unintentionally clicking on my uploads, I know they are. PBase management, keep up the tremendous work! Just because teary eyed whiners can be the most vocal doesn't necessarily mean they are the majority...


Well, clearly calling people who disagree with you "teary eyed whiners" is a compelling and convincing argument. Almost insurmountable in terms of the raw power of its logic.

And yet... there is this small issue nagging at the back of my mind, what is it now?

Ah, now I recall.

Shoshanna made a valid point. That doesn't mean that the others in this thread aren't valid either, however much you want to disparage them with tried and true name calling.

I'd never thought of recommending PBase for business use, because I didn't know anyone in that business (who didn't have their own site) anyway. But she's right, using it for that purpose would, I expect, be frustrating. However I used to recommend PBase to friends. I don't, and can't in good conscience do that any more. Not because of the stats. I don't care about the stats as such. As I've said elsewhere I've never trusted PBase stats anyway, not that I'm arrogant enough to assume that things that don't matter to me shouldn't matter to other users, as some may.

No, it's because that nagging at the back of my mind consists of the words "what's next"?

When the power came back on, the database wouldn't come back up. That makes me wonder what kind of state it was in in the first place and about why there wasn't a "switchover" backup database as would be found in most professionally run places, but perhaps something has been learned from that... or perhaps not, since we're never told. As far as the stats go, does anyone genuinely believe that if the old system still worked it wouldn't have been brought on line while the new one was developed? My take is that the reason that a new system is being developed is that the old one doesn't work any more and if that doesn't work, it makes me wonder what else won't work next time there's an outage.

And it doesn't even need to be an outage. It can sometimes be the arbitrary pulling of a feature like JavaScript. I'm not disputing the need to have disabled Javascript. I am, however, disputing the need to do so without bothering to tell anyone until they started yelling "hey, how come my gallery display doesn't work any more?" Similarly (although this isn't a PBase feature), I note the way that NoOutlet's departure was handled with complete silence. The one admin who at least attempted some form of systematic communication with the members, with a handful of exceptions the only one who ever seemed to implement anything, gone silently. Was he replaced? Has anyone else left? Who knows?

Not that any of this will matter to those who just want to upload a couple of dozen images of Mitten the kitten frolicking in the back yard with the imaginative titles IMG0702.jpg to IMG0815.jpg. For those people, have at it because PBase is just fine for you.

But people don't need to be professionals to have more at stake than just $23 per year. The ones who take time to develop their galleries, to add captions, to put in hyperlinks to other images or sites, to develop .css's, even those masochistic enough to geotag; all of this takes time. It can be a LOT of time. And reproducing that work on other sites would also take a lot of time, though perhaps less than PBase since a lot of them actually have APIs.

Which means that many, not all, but many of the "teary eyed whiners" don't need to be relying on PBase as a business to have more skin in the game than their measly 23 or 46 bucks. They have investments of time, effort and imagination. And therefore they have legitimate concerns about being kept in the dark by a site owner who seems to have elevated being disconnected from the paying membership to some kind of Zen like art form.

We simply don't know whether PBase has become so large or complex that it's gotten away from the ability of the current management to run it. We don't know why the "couple of days" has slipped so massively. We don't know what lies ahead for PBase. We don't know who's working there aside from Slug, or even whether anyone else works there any more. Everything has to be taken on blind faith and while that's fine for Mitten's owner who could reproduce their "gallery" on Flickr in 5 minutes flat complete with value enhancing pretty pink and blue logos, it's certainly going to matter to someone who has spent days or weeks of work time getting their galleries the way they want them.

If you want to rely on that blind faith, then vaya con Dios. But for others, it raises legitimate questions about whether to persist with PBase or leave it to slide into Internet folklore as "Hey, remember that photo sharing site that used to be great, what was its name again...?"

ragnarandren
 
Posts: 4

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Tue Nov 10, 2009 11:29 pm


The only thing that doesn´t work in my galleries is the counter, it says the same thing as it did six weeks ago. My pictures are available on the internet, I can upload new photos, I can share the photos with other people, comments may be made, the guestbook may have new comments. For me Pbase is running OK. The counter and the statistics are nice to have but they are not the main thing. The most important thing is the sharing of pictures, and that is working OK. I still have 12 more months to go before I have to pay anything. I am willing to wait and see what´s going to happen. The site has been doing OK in my six years. Hopefully, it will come back with "the extras" but the most important meaning of pbase is allright as of now.

You can make good pictures without a histogram! Ciao, Ragnar

claeson
 
Posts: 29

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:32 am


Same here. Everything works except for the stat/counter. Loading my own profile page takes quite some time though, but that's old news.
But I'm beginning to miss the stat/counter thing. I rarely get any comments on my pics, so it feels nice to be able to check the stats now
and then, to see that someone at least is looking at them... *sob* :( I was so happy the other to find out that I had over 800 000 unread
messages waiting! :D Well... I guess I should have known better, they all turned out to be fake..they didn't even exist for real...! :(

cheers
JC

(BTW, why is "[img]" in OFF -mode on the board?) :?

hmetal
 
Posts: 246

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:47 am


I agree with akmc. In fact, I've purchased both Flickr and Zenfolio Pro accounts. I use Zenfolio to sell my works and Flickr as a general portfolio since my space usage there is unlimited and I don't want those photos using up my PBase credits.

PBase for me, is my hobby photography site, where my wife/muse and I experiment and post what used to be daily. I do post what I consider my best as photo-a-day but I needed a more professional look for my commercial work and a good shopping cart system.

Anyways.. to stay on topic.. My Pbase stats are the only thing that isn't working now.

Has Slug or any of his admins said how much longer until stats returns?

wvaphoto
 
Posts: 21

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 12:57 am


Hi folks,
I guess I need to say something here (why - I don't know). Since people can't vent their frustrations at the management, they are firing away at each other. Unless it makes you feel better, you are wasting your time, because Slug stated in his comments that he didn't visit the forums because it was too painful. I don't have a lot of images on pbase, and I really do like being able to customize the look. I refer folks interested in buying prints here because it is convenient. Pbase is a real bargain whether I have stats counters or not. However, when I renewed, it was with the understanding that the product would be the same, which it is not. That's the only problem I have with the current situation.
I enjoy folks looking at my photos because I really do enjoy making them. I would like to know how many "hits" I've had on a given photo or gallery, but it isn't the end of the world if I don't have it for awhile. This is a great place for photographers from all over the world to get together, but no one will want to be a part of a "free for all" fight. So load up your flamethrowers, I can take it (and if slamming each other makes you feel better, have at it). I'm not going anywhere because I had just renewed my subscription.
Rich

pegsam
 
Posts: 87

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:37 am


wvaphoto wrote:Hi folks,
I guess I need to say something here (why - I don't know). Since people can't vent their frustrations at the management, they are firing away at each other. Unless it makes you feel better, you are wasting your time, because Slug stated in his comments that he didn't visit the forums because it was too painful.
Rich


You raise a good point Rich. Perhaps we are taking some of our frustrations out on each other. Just for the record, I have complained directly to the administrators. Sadly, the response from them has been just as silent as in this forum. :( On the other hand, I can complain in this forum and am sure to get a response from someone here. :)

akmc_in_au
 
Posts: 954

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:10 am


wvaphoto wrote:This is a great place for photographers from all over the world to get together, but no one will want to be a part of a "free for all" fight. So load up your flamethrowers, I can take it (and if slamming each other makes you feel better, have at it).


Geez Rich, you're never going to garner any decent flames like that!

You need to start calling people "whiney little whingers" or "ostrich-like fanbois", depending on which side you want to get hit from. :wink:

pegsam
 
Posts: 87

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:25 am


akmc_in_au wrote:"ostrich-like fanbois"


Lol. I had to look that one up. A thought-provoking flame, if ever there was one. Well done, Alan.

rickbricker
 
Posts: 5

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 6:43 am


Wow....327 posts on this topic!I know now why no one is looking at my or your images.The Forum is way more interesting these days.I better start learning how to make my own webpage for my images....at least for the few good ones I have on here.I don't care about the $23 or $123 or whatever invested,my time is by far the most valuable thing to me to lose on this site.
You know,it's somewhat akin to a family member going bad,the loss we all feel here.I spend a great amount of time on this site.It has been a very enjoyable part of my day,both reading any comments I may have been fortunate enough to receive and looking at and learning from others work on here.
So to come on here,have no count info. and worse,be forced to relog in every time I change galleries is taking it's toll.
Later,
Rick

i_fly
 
Posts: 25

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 3:25 pm


rickbricker wrote:Wow....327 posts on this topic!I know now why no one is looking at my or your images.The Forum is way more interesting these days.I better start learning how to make my own webpage for my images....at least for the few good ones I have on here.I don't care about the $23 or $123 or whatever invested,my time is by far the most valuable thing to me to lose on this site.
You know,it's somewhat akin to a family member going bad,the loss we all feel here.I spend a great amount of time on this site.It has been a very enjoyable part of my day,both reading any comments I may have been fortunate enough to receive and looking at and learning from others work on here.
So to come on here,have no count info. and worse,be forced to relog in every time I change galleries is taking it's toll.
Later,
Rick


I've been on Pbase since 2003 and this has been my main place ( and most of the time the only one )to display my photos. I sincerely agree with other's view on Pbase strongest asset i.e. the friendly community that I've enjoyed her during those 6 years, most particularily during my days of PAD. I do care about Pbase, and so far I've been loyal to this site, refusing the temptations to jump to other sites, whatever fancy offers have been on the table. However, and not least due to my fondness of Pbase, I'm gradually worrying of how things are evolving. I can not see how we can sit idle and smiling while the boat seems to be sinking. With each passing day without any solution,and without any infromation on what is really happening, just that ever painful silence from Slug and Co, my fear increases of bigger problems than hitherto has been revealed to us. From what I know from my conversations to experts in the field, I'm gradually refusing to belive the little that we've been told, and my hunch of Pbase being a slowly sinking ship gets stronger and stronger. I have no option to wait and see what happens, but I'm definitely doing that smiling. My only hope here is that Slug and Co step out of that black box with some prove that I'm wrong, until then, I can't help wondering that somewhere in the background people are struggling with bigger problems than those laid on our table.

lynnh
 
Posts: 3633

Re: 24-Sep Downtime

Post Wed Nov 11, 2009 4:41 pm


I'm not sure I understand what's going on in this forum. If you don't like Pbase, then find a site that suits your needs. If you like Pbase, then stay and keep posting. Why argue about it endlessly? Do ya'll really feel that you need to defend your position? If you have Pbase friends, and they are genuinely interested in your work, then they'll visit you on Flickr or SmugMug or where ever you go. I'm starting to think ya'll just like to fight. This isn't the "friendly" Pbase community that I've come to know over the years.
PEACE.
LYNNH
All that is gold does not glitter, Not all those who wander are lost; The old that is strong does not wither, Deep roots are not reached by the frost ~ J. R. R. Tolkien

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